Tuesday, November 6, 2007

Bobbi Ann Mason's “Shiloh”

Hmmmm, a Southern man!


The feminist literary critics have aided us in analyzing and understanding how female characters are written in literature, often demonizing male characters in the process. Consequently, we have given very little consideration to “how” men are written. In Bobbie Ann Mason’s work we are introduced to the marginalized male – men who once seemed to wield power but are now only remnants of their formerly glorious selves, usually at the expense of the downhome feminist. In “Shiloh,” how are Leroy’s attempts at adjusting to his “new” life – problems with his marriage and troubles with the urbanization of his neighborhood – evidence of a “weak” male?

I’m trying not to write a leading question, but . . . what becomes problematic for feminist/female writers if in order to empower female characters, they “must” write weak male characters? What are the consequences of this literary “movement”?

126 comments:

Anonymous said...

In this blog I will discuss what a great story "Shiloh" is. THE END!!

Anonymous said...

(just in case nobody got my joke, i'm making fun of the thesis we all had to do for religion, and how Ms. Lagrimas said not to make judgements on the book,ex...great story.) humor me and laugh at my joke

Anonymous said...

to ashley..... HAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAA =]

Anonymous said...

HAHA ahsley...but not really...yes really...

So, i guess there can be several problems that arise from belittling men...because Seriously, if that's the only way to empower women, then i THINK we may have a problem... right!?! i mean, i think that just toatally makes us weaker, as females, becuase we "can't" find any other way of "promoting" our sex... and this is so "typical" too... come on! NORMA JEAN (like marilyn =]) is always "working out" and checking her "biceps" and i thought it was so lame how she had just finished up her "six week body building course" (p. 1129) HAHAHA... seriously! BUT i suppose the femisnism movement is good, I mean, it does empower us, and teach us to be strong, different and move out tof the sookie cutter mold that society sets for us, but it should be done in a way that doen's belittle men, because it just makes us seem that much weaker, and quite frankly meaner... and I'm kinda rambling right now... I have more to say, I just don't know how to ariculate it yet..

I'LL BE BACK!

Anonymous said...

Feminist writers write weak male characters to underline the contrast being shown. I guess some people would probably take this as a feminist writer agreeing that males are the dominant sex in society and they are only trying to rebel against the standard, but I think in order to make a point things have to be exaggerated to creat a foil. Leroy could be described as the mighty mouse the story claims he once was, but that would lessen Norma Jean's strength.

Olivia would like to thank Lucille for typing this (Olive asked me to put this in, i swear and you can tell because i NEVER call her olivia!)

Anonymous said...

His attempts to make his wife and himself happy appear to be futile.
In my opinion, his demeanor seems to be quite indifferent towards everything in his life, specifically the death of his baby, Randy where it says " Leroy remembers handing Randy to a nurse at the emergency room, as though he was offering her a large doll as a present" He is so weak, he isn't assertive or strong-willed as his wife is. He isn't the dominator, he just lays back and smokes a joint "without a care in the world", but that isn't true! he realizes that he has worries but yet he still doesn't take initiative, his character is stagnant. To me, his wish of making a log cabin is just hopes and dreams, not reality! On the contrary, his wife is strong and determined; she takes a composition class and keeps physically fit. She is productive physically and intellectualy! The roles have obviously reversed! But I think that for the time Mason wrote this story it was already a revolutionary period (1980s)of the woman projecting herself into the outside world with power and yelling "I AM WOMAN!" Mason definitely includes events and social norms that are becoming during the time she wrote this!

Anonymous said...

And I mean Come on! Leroy was holding Norma back! Norma didn't need, pardon my word choice, a loser for a husband!! I don't blame her for wanting to leave him, if someone isn't passionate about making their life better seriously! (i.e. not through building a log cabin!) why should a spouse waste their time!


I don't think that Mason is exagerrating the idea of feminism, in my opinion Chopin is much more dramatic! but anyways, Mason simply plants the seed of knowledge to inspire women to be productive for their own well-being as humans! And Mason does depict reality in how some men are or can be, sluggish, not realistic, and lack of determination!

Sorry, just wanted to add some more! : )

Anonymous said...

IN RESPONSE TO JESSICA O'S COMMENT

actually i disagree. Leroy is a drugged up waste of flesh with no job and no aspiration. He represents the people in the world who are well intentioned, yet fail to help. I actually kind of admire Norma Jean for a while because she was trying to break out of this hole, but in the end she says "I don't know what I'm saying. Forget it." (p.1133) she quit smoking immediately after her mother freaked out.

women aren't painted as the hero in this picture like they are in other stories. but norma jean does show this kind of strength that is not normally portrayed with other female characters.

i actually like norma jean. I'm saying this because i'm "assuming" you don't like her.

that's the end of olive's thoughts =) the next time i comment, it will be for my own genius thoughts

PS Olive would like everyone to know that i'm a well worthy friend with shiny biceps and a cute face! =)

Anonymous said...

I'm BACK

so i get where olive and apple are comming from... and it is importatnt to show a contrast and perhaps that is Mason's goal...to EXPLICITLY show the contrast between Leroy, the OBVIOUSLY weak male (i even thought he was lanky and skinny and all shrivly... even his name makes him sound kinda wimp-ish) and NORMA JeAN , the body builder the one who takes charge, the one who shows no emotionn (even her name is kinda thunderous and ARRGGHH!!!) going back to emotions, Leroy is the emotional one, he has "feelings" "wants" "needs" which, is afterall "typical" of female characters... so this story is totally a switch up of the gender roles...

we can't always belittle men though... we'd hurt their feeling WAY TOO much... =]

Unknown said...

HOLD UP noW.. don't ASSUME, cuz we all know what happens when you do that...

=)

i never said i liked LEROY, cuz i agree with OLIVE, he is a waste, i mean he's kinda pathetic the whole time, and just AHH!!! frusrating!... we is kinda loser-ish, and i almost even feel bad for him... SERIOUSLY, he has no backbone... GROW A SPINE DAMNIT!

and NORMA JEAN, i see her as this HULKY hungarian olympic athlete... it's not that i don't like her, I alwasy think it's awesome when women have the upper hand, i just kinda see her as a commical character, and jsut typical "man hating" type of feminist character...but hell YA i think she's kinda awesome...

OH OH OH
and did anyone see JUNEBUG?! i totally saw this story taking place in that movive, i mean the way everyone talked, and everyone's names...down in the south...



<3

Anonymous said...

In response to Jessica O's comment:

I agree, we shouldn't try to hurt men, even though men were once and sometimes even today are oppressive, two wrongs don't make a right!

We can show our power through determination, and proving them wrong that we are NOT the weaker sex through our actions! Women are a strong and stubborn( i mean that in a nice way) by overcoming hardship we show our strength.

I'm sure are actions can be a bit more subtle and no longer belittle men, but on those rare occasions sometimes men deserve a little taste of their own medicine. ; )

Anonymous said...

When feminist writers exaggerate the weakness of male characters too much it seems to become more like a joke than a stance against inequality. Becuase men belittle women, women should not right a wrong with another wrong and retaliate by belittling them; we can't stoop to their level. The feminism movement is definietly a good change and way to stand up to men,but maybe feminist can elevate the women without having to go to such extreme exaggerations.

On another note... I'm not sure if it was suppose to be funny but, on page 1132 when Norma Jean says, "I want to leave you" to Leroy was just made me laugh becuase it was such a random thing to say while having a picnic at a war memorial =]. Also the way Leory is "feminized" is quite funny as well (the way he notices minute, trivial things/details pg 1127 and he does needlepoint pg 1126 LOL)

Anonymous said...

OOOPs =O

that "ELPHIE" up there is me, JESSICA OCHOA... i don't know what happened

<3

Anonymous said...

okay, sorry again, those previous two where me "anonymous" and "elphie"

MAN, UGH!


ARRGH!

Anonymous said...

MAN! i hate this, i totallycan't get out what i want to say...

OKAY, so In responsse to APOLLONIA,
I'm not saying hurt men, but i think it jsut is nice to see women poortrayed in a higher light.... and HELL ya, women are stubborn... i mean seriously, if we weren't so catty, women would definitely rule the world...
subtlties are great, but I think this story doew dramatize the female and male characters... I mean I'm not astaunch femminist, and I'm not a MAN-HATER... but it is good to raise the female moral and show them as equals to men...




and in respons to Emily she's right... it does become a joke to belittle men, and over-exxagerate women...

but the best part IS when Norma Jean says "I want to leave you." for me it was such a shock, I LIRERALLY gasped... i really didn't see it comming... but oh well





watch out... i just might come back again =]

Anonymous said...

OKAY, sorry again but that anonymous was me again (JESSICA OCHOA)... I keep forgetting to put my name...

SORRY

Anonymous said...

In response to Olive...
I see her point in saying that an exaggeration is what will get people's attentions because I know the exaggerations used in this stroy definite caught my attention and made me laugh. The exaggeration of the minute details he notices such as Norma putting on her slippers at 9 o'clock and staring away when cutting onions pg. 1127 definetly feminized Leory since women notice a lot of detail and are a lot more observant.

I liked how the story made Leroy womanly and Norma Jean manly (As jessica mentioned). As the stroy progresses,the traditional roles of man and woman were switched; Leroy changes into the housewife and Norma into the working man.

Anonymous said...

My impression of Leroy throughout the story was “yeah…this guy is a wuss…needlepoint and popsicle cabins? wth?” (though popsicle stick bridge building rocks, right Jojo/Austyn?) He definitely epitomizes the stereotype of a “weak” male – staying home all day daydreaming and not doing anything productive. He apathetically lets Norma Jean become the sole breadwinner in the house, while he fantasizes unrealistically of building a log cabin instead of taking the initiative and finding a job. I wanted to tell him to get a move on and do something with his life. I don’t necessarily like Norma Jean though. She seems like a scary hulking type of robot that feels no emotion, which I guess was the point the author was trying to make.

“When feminist writers exaggerate the weakness of male characters too much it seems to become more like a joke than a stance against inequality.”

And I agree with Emily that feminists too often exaggerate their position to the point where it’s either funny or annoying (i.e. Kate Chopin, but that’s my own personal opinion…sorry in advance to those who like her).

I also agree with Jessica O. when she says that there has to be other ways for feminists to make a stance on behalf of women that doesn’t involve stooping to the level of men and belittling them. What does it say about women if the only way we can elevate ourselves is by bashing men? Feminists should concentrate on emphasizing the power of women in situations where both sexes are equal…I think that the feminist message is much more powerful that way.

Anonymous said...

ahhh my comment looks long. It's my reaction and response combined though, so don't blame me if this turns out to be 30 pages ;)

And Ashley, I laughed :)

Anonymous said...

i just started the story but i just wanted to see if anyone had written anything...

first...a very deserving "hahaha" goes out to ashley, maybe even an "lmao" =]

lucy...i suppose you just said that you never call olive olivia because you assumed that we would all think the exact same thing so in ACTUALITY, you wrote that yourself so that we would think that exact same thing you want us to think...aha! clever, yet not so much ;] nice try
[shiny biceps? really...come on now...]

oh && jessica idk if it's your computer or you...but uhhh yeah...
=]

i'll be back when i finish the story
just thought i'd write something since i'm already here...i hope ms. lagrimas doesn't get mad at my pointless post since it wastes her paper when she prints this out...sorry! =]

Anonymous said...

I think what is problematic in making male characters weak in order to empower female characters is that it shows that women can only become strong and dominant when men become weak. I think it is more powerful in showing a woman working her way up to become equally strong or stronger than a man when the man is still powerful.

Anyway... so yeah I think Leroy is pretty wimpy. I thought it was really funny that he started to do needlepoint. My favorite lines (pg. 1126):

"It's my needlepoint," he explains. "This is a Star Trek pillow cover."
"All the big football players on TV do it," he says.

way to show your manliness,leroy!! =P

Anonymous said...

in response to JACKIE... I say we shoot for 40 this time...

leroy is patheitic, i see him sitting in a corner with his legs spread open (NOT IN A DIRTY WAY) like a little kid playing with LINOCLN LOGS... I USED to play with those, it really ISN'T that hard...

and I also agree with Jackie:
"NoRMA jean is a scary HULKING robot with no emotion..." HECK YES!

Anonymous said...

MAN I LOVE <3 this blogging thing... it is AWWWESOme! (can't you tell)

Anonymous said...

when i first started the story, i pegged both leroy and norma jean as *ahem* losers. it didn't seem as though they are working to anything or aspiring for a better life. as it turns out though, leroy is in fact the weaker of the two - both physically and emotionally. in fact, he would seem to be norma jean's polar opposite. he has a steel pin in his hip, she takes body building courses. he dwells on the past (evidenced by his inability to move past randy's death), while she moves forward (learning new songs to play on the electric organ and attending night school). he is reticent, she is assertive. it would seem that norma jean is more empowered because of her proximity to such a weak man. any foible of hers does not compare to his - she smokes on the sly, he seems to have a perpetual joint (which is less socially acceptable). it is obvious though, that were it not for norma jean, leroy wouldn't really have anything to live for after his means of earning a livelihood (essentially his masculinity) was taken away from him. he was emasculated when his role as breadwinner ceased to exist.

i agree with jessica. leroy just exudes femininity. his overall demeanor is that which society has come to accept as "feminine" characteristics (forgive me for mentioning so insulting a generalization). he's needy and contemplative, but not proactive enough in the events of his life to garner the reader's respect.

Anonymous said...

oh... by the way lagrimas... that picture of that man up there with the long dirty hair is pretty SEX-AY

good job =)

Anonymous said...

oh and this isn't really related but... has anyone here ever seen that movie "the country girl" (with bing crosby and grace kelly)???

this story seemed sooo familiar to me because it's similar to that of the movie. the husband is unable to forget a past incident involving their child and becomes a shadow of his former self as a result (only in the movie, the man became an alcoholic, leroy seems overtly fond of his joints...=[). the wife also wears the pants in the family, essentially carrying her hollowed-out-shell of a husband. both the movie and the story made me somewhat spiteful of the character of the pitiful husband, all sad and non-productive...like, "stop exuding emo-ness!"

anyways, yeah...it's a good movie. but it made me cry. and bing crosby has such a nice voice. =]

Anonymous said...

and CLAUDIA... you make no sense =]

and JESsICA...
you're right too... cuz if we just put down men, we're not really elevated... they're jsut below us, but if we work our way up, than MAN remains static, and we MOVE UP... and "needle poins" hahaha, my granmda does that... SHOOT i do that =]

Anonymous said...

OH, one more thing...


JOANNA... I love GRACE KELLY

Anonymous said...

Does anybody imagine them as like trailer people or hicks or something??? or is that just me? If anyone has seen the movie "Raising Arizona" w/ Nicolas Cage you'll understand what I'm saying.

Anyway, if Leroy was not so drugged up all the time, maybe he can see that there were so many signs of his wife leaving him. It takes more than a day or one death to ruin a marriage. I say good for her for discovering that living w/ him is the equivalent to living in a dump (literally, they ARE living in a dump!).

Mason (the author) obviously makes Leroy needy and dependent on Norma. I just find it so ironic that Leroy asks Norma if he is still the king around here (p 1131) and she flexes her muscles before answering. TAKE A HINT DRUGGY!!! SHE'S the king, which makes him a QUEEN. -_- but seriously I don't think he is pulling his weight around the house. so Mason uses this chance to juxtapose the different characteristics of the two main subjects of the story.

As for the question, I do not like how it is phrase. The question already assumes that there is a problem with the way female writers display their weak and strong characters. If a male is portrayed as hard working as he climbs his way to the top, that's okay but if a woman works hard and makes her man look bad then that is forbidden. With more works like this short story the feminist movement will only be receiving more fuel.

Anonymous said...

To Jessica's comment

I noticed that you wrote Norma shows no emotions and she has a thunderous name, Norma?

I think that emotions are shown in different ways. Crying does not always show emotion but being serious doesn't mean there is a lack of emotions. Towards the end of the story, (p 1132) Norma is holding back tears as she is trying to leave Leroy. Women have great endurance capacities and for her to be so close to walking out but say be hesitant is, in fact, the best way of portraying emotion. She is willing to stay in this terrible marriage that does not seem to yield happiness which shows endurance and forgiveness as well as love because she's trying to give him another chance.

Anonymous said...

I also notice that many of you think the author is bashing men.... has anyone ever thought that maybe she was just being honest??? Forget the gender of Leroy (i sometimes forget because he acts funny) and just look at his character's personality. If a woman acted like that, is she weak?

Anonymous said...

OH and to claudia!

AND I FEEL STRONGLY ABOUT THIS!!!

my biceps are VERY SHINY!

Anonymous said...

my brain is drawing a _______.

and i'm procrastinating.

Anonymous said...

You're right, Lucy. If a woman acted like Leroy, I'd still consider her weak. But you can't deny that making a "masculine" truck driver do needlepoint and play with popsicle sticks isn't exaggeration to the point of ridiculousness. Feminists would have a much better time advocating their cause if readers didn't consider their stories outrageous.

Anonymous said...

TO LUCY...
NORMA jean is just not shown in the typical female "light"

she is "strong" (physically and mentally) "determined" "driven" and she knows what she wants which aren't "TYPICAL female characteristics" you know?
and HELLO she doesn't stay in the marriage, she says "I WANT to leave you" (p.1132)

and even though she "endures" I mean, she really doesn't.. she's always at shcool, and working out and ignoring him anyway, and i thought it was SO funny when she said "In some ways a woman prefers a man who wonders." (p. 1132) so really, to me, it jsut kinda seems like she ignores her marriage... it almost seems like they're dorm-mates, or room-mates or something....
and when LEROY says "SHE closes her eyes when she's in bed" (p. 1127) i think it just furhter exemplifies how she IS ignoring her marriage, i mean, i kinda got the impression she didn't even want to be intimate with him... and he jsut sounds like a little wimpering puppy when he says this...

=]

Anonymous said...

Leroy really annoys me. It seems to me that throughout the whole story all he did was complain that he and his wife had developed a distant relationship. But, like apple says, he never took any initiative to change their circumstances. Mason's depiction of Leroy's character definitely relays a feminist point of view. While men are usually the stronger gender, Norma Jean clearly holds the power in this story. Mason also switches the roles that men and women typically had. Because Leroy is so weak he is unable to let go of the past which hinders the two's relationship and ultimately leads his wife to leave him.

And to jessica's comment, i totally agree that belittling men only makes us look weaker. There are much better ways for us to appear dominant. And to Lucy, i also thought it was funny about the king thing. If I were Leroy and my wife had bigger muscles than me, I would be veeeeeery scared. And Jessica, its nice that you have so many comments but you're really contributing to the whole "30 page novel" that just causes Ms. Lagrimas to waste paper when she prints out the blog.

Anonymous said...

And LUCY,
i don't think she's so much "BASHING" men as she is just making them commical... it is an exageration..

and Jakcie, I agree with you...

Anonymous said...

(haha I think Jessica's comments alone made this blog 30 pages again)

Was it really Mason's intent to show that Leroy's pathetic lifestyle was the result of a dominating feminist wife? I had to strain to catch any hints of feminism on Norma Jean's part. She was simply being PRACTICAL - Leroy was pathetic. Instead of trying to live out stupid hallucinogen influenced ideas, he could have been out job-hunting.

I mean, Leroy completely proves his loserish-ness when Norma says she's leaving him and instead of immediately going after her, he tries "to comprehend that his marriage is breaking up, but for some reason he is wondering about white slabs in a graveyard" (p.1011). Um, yeah - Leroy, lay off the herb because reading a stoned person's narrative is the most annoying thing ever.

I disagree with Jessica and Jackie about feminists belittling men. True feminists are not sexist. It's not as if they are saying all men are idiots in their stories - they DO acknowledge that there are good men in the world. We must not forget that feminism exists because there were and ARE men out there (not ALL men) who see women as second rate citizens. It is these stupid men that feminists direct their stories at. Plus, it's not like these weak men are completely unrealistic- I'm sure we've all met boys as stupid as Leroy.

( Sorry if this is long..at least I can't be blamed for being the first comment this time :] )

Anonymous said...

(haha I think Jessica's comments alone made this blog 30 pages again).... I AGREE WITH ALI

i just felt like saying that since jessica o filled like so many pages already

JO said...

agreed ali and emily too... jessica, do you love the story or love leaving comments?

i'll blog in a sec.

Anonymous said...

I think that Leroy exemplifies a typical "weak male" because he knows that there are problems in his life that need to be solved and he does nothing about them. After he is injured and can no longer drive his truck he is "not sure what to do next" so he just sits at home dreaming about his log cabin(p.1002). He also realizes that he and his wife are having marital problems but he sits back and does nothing (p.1007). To me it seemed like he was just waiting for someone to step in and fix everything for him rather than having to think up a solution to his problems on his own. In a way it seemed like after he stopped driving trucks, he realized that while he was gone the world had moved on without him and left him behind.

Anonymous said...

in response to jojo emily and ALI...
NUH-UH! it's not ALL me

and i do like the story, I mean it's really easy for me to get passionate about it... SERIOUSLY

Anonymous said...

On the topic of the feminist literary movement, I agree with Emily because it did seem like the stroy was a little over exaggerated. I think that by making the the two character such extreme opposites, the author makes it hard for readers to take the message behind the story seriously. Women can be made to appear strong without completely belittling the men in their lives. Otherwise its not really a feminist movement if a man has to be extremely weak and thoughtless in order for the woman to be seen as strong. Depicting men in such a negative light might actually hurt the feminist literary movement rather than help it.

Anonymous said...

Ok, so first of all, what I found hilarious about the whole thing was when Norma Jean make a list of jobs that Leroy could do… “Things you could do, you could get a job as a guard at Union Carbide…” Hint, hint, Leroy, [excuse my wording, but] get off your lazy a** and start doing something. His adjustments to his new life show him as a weak male because they affect him emotionally. Earlier, when he was driving his big “manly” rig, he may not have considered his marital problems very much, but now that he’s home, these factors affect him more directly. Also in agreement with what many others have said, what does it say about women if we have to make men characters weak in order to greater emphasize our empowerment? Can’t we show dominance on our own, even when being compared to a strong, powerful man? If this is the case, then this “movement” may not be taken seriously, which may regress any progress that has been made… and so on [you guys get where I’m going with this right?]

Now, to Ashley: ahahahaha :]
to Joanna: good job for not blogging at like 2 in the morning :P
and to Jackie: I completely agree with your 8:08 post “He apathetically lets Norma Jean become the sole breadwinner in the house…” while he seems to be acting like the house wife… and a lazy one at that.

oh yeah, and I love the language!!!

Anonymous said...

Lucy ! I took your job and found a freudian line: "I'd give anything if I could just get these muscles to where they're real hard"

Anonymous said...

When I think truckdriver, long nights on the highway come to mind. However, even after getting off the road, he is also left all by his lonesome =( His wife does not help at all with his physical therapy, but is busy "building herself up" (1123). Leroy is a lost man; the job he knew is now associated with fright and "he is not sure what to do next." He does attempt to ease his confusion or lack of true action by picking up new hobbies, things to keep him occupied. He picks up detail-oriented hobbies: string art, crafts with Popsicle sticks, needlepoint, and his obsession with the building of a log house. It's said that women are more detail-oriented. Since Leroy is not out chopping wood or running loose on their small town, he is considered a "weak" male because he'd rather stay at home even when his wife is out preparing a new life. He is oblivious to her separation, and it's so apparent to the reader. She is becoming stronger physically, that in turn elevates her self-esteem. Norma Jean learns to write essays (in preparation to become more advanced academically). He is weak in that he cannot see that his wife does not want to be with him. He has his suspicions about her faithfulness but chooses to keep quiet. That is weak.
It's funny how the author refers to the feminist movement on pg. 1132 as Leroy when he asks, "Is this one of those women's lib things?" This is his reaction to her declaration.
It is not realistic to write males as weak, nor is it fair to females. It sends the message that the only way females can be seen as empowered would be for the males to be weak. The "movement" could actually hurt the feminist stance because in order for women to be strong they must oppress the men. This is contradictory due to the fact that women should be advocating equality not "oppression of the other sex" (the idea they are trying to eliminate). This story did not sell me on the rights of women, because Norma Jean was not a character to be looked up to.

Anonymous said...

side note: I would be a little annoyed myself if there was someone sitting at home all day, staring at me.

just saying...

Anonymous said...

okay, these male protagonists just keep disappointing me. i'm sorry but jesus h. christ enough is enough. poor little leroy reminded me somewhat in a weird way of kip from "napoleon dynamite" (pre-lafawnduh kip & without all the smart remarks, mainly just the look and his way of speaking)

Leroy's attempts are evidence of a "weak" male because honestly, when a guy tries too hard, it just makes him look like a bigger loser than he already is (joanna used the word "loser", so i'm just following suit, i know you don't like it ms. lagrimas =]) i mean a log cabin? seriously. if you want to get your wife back you need to fix "other things" (if you catch my drift), not build her a popsticle stick playhouse. i just wished he would have been a bit more creative. obviously taking advice from mabel wasn't beneficial either since...well yeah...his wife basically dumped him (i didn't like the ending by the way, it felt slightly blunt)

norma jean, i don't know why billie jean kept popping into my head whenever i read her name haha. i just imagined her in one of those tiny red leotards with her muscles popping out all shiny and whatnot. DISGUSTING. a little too rough around the edges if you ask me. like lucy said, she's the KING...no kidding

i agree with joanna "he was emasculated when his role as breadwinner ceased to exist."
when a man feels his masculinity is threatened, especially by a woman, he becomes desperate to replace what was taken from him (unintentionally) in hopes that these new hobbies (building model houses and sweing) will fill the empty space in his heart. however leroy's problem is much deeper than that. the root of the matter is his troubled marriage. period.

elfin. ;]

Anonymous said...

I agree with Olive, Emily, Jackie, and Brittany (yup, I put Ctrl+F to good use =D) saying how this whole story is a big exaggeration. It does come to the point where it becomes what it is, "fiction." The lesson is... It's better if the meaning was in between the lines, but no. The weak man was the only way Mason was able to make the woman strong.

Anonymous said...

is that the guy from lost?

Anonymous said...

sewing*

and i just thought i'd pull a josephine and say "This comment is not related to the story, but that is one awesome picture! :)"

hehe.

Anonymous said...

MS. LAGRIMAS! We can all tell this is going to be a long blog. So... please print double-sided. =)

save those trees!

JO said...

What caught my attention was what Norma Jean said to Leroy on page 1131, "Your name means 'the king." Leroy questions, "Am I still king around here?" That's the real question, is Leroy the king around the house anymore? In a stereotyped home, the man is usually the one who wears the pants, brings home the bacon, and whatever other saying that fits appropriate here.

What becomes problematic for female writers in order to empower female characters, is that it seems slightly ridiculous. I mean, "Norma Jean is working on her pectorals." But I think because of this contrast between characteristics is so wide, the reader can gain a better understanding of the roles of women and men.

Anonymous said...

Okay, well from the beginning I thought Leroy was pretty weak. Maybe I'm just mean, but 'Leroy' for a name? It's just not very manly :X. anyway, i thought that all his attempts at adjusting showed his weaknesses in that it showed a kind of role reversal. He was the one who wanted to be more involved with his wife; he was always asking questions and waiting around for her. I also saw his hurt leg as a physical embodiment of his weakness as a character. Also, when his wife decides to leave him, he doesn't put up much of a fight at all. When his wife leaves him at the table, he just sits there and thinks a bit longer (pg 1133.)
The last thing I want to say about Leroy and his weakness is, needlepoint. I mean really, what manly man does Star Trek needlepoint?

In regards to the feminists, I do think that by constantly belittling men and exaggerating women they are hurting their cause. It does get to the point, like Jackie and Emily said, where it's just funny or annoying. I was laughing when in the first line it says Norma Jean was working on her pectorals (pg. 1123.)
I also agree with Jessica when she says that women may have a problem if belittling is the only way they can empower themselves. I think that if feminists bash men constantly, no one will take them seriously and then their cause would be lost.

Anonymous said...

ahhh so I have no idea who I'm going to respond to... there's so many LONG posts!

But i agree with most of you guys, Leroy needs to get up, get out of the house and do something...oh and stop smoking those joints. =P Norma Jean is kicking his butt by body building, going to night school, playing the electric organ, and works at a drugstore. She's making the most out of life!

oh! i totally agree with jessica... norma jean reminded me of a hungarian olympic athlete too! ahahaha.

oh and lucy, I totally saw them as trailer park hicks! =)

(hey ms. lagrimas, is the guy in the pic "sawyer" from LOST??)

Anonymous said...

in response to jackie:

I SO AGREE WITH WHAT YOU SAID ABOUT HIM AND HIS WORKING STATUS! i cant believe he'd just sit there and build popsicle stick houses all day instead of getting a job. He even makes excuses with his, "I can't do something where I'd have to stand up all day." She told him about a job where he would get a stool!! pg. 1127.
gah!

austyn said...

first of all, just wanted to point out the small jersey boys reference "can't take my eyes off of you" :}
okay well, i believe that women are intelligent enough to prove how empowered we are without belittling men. if women can still appear empowered in stories where men are equal, then it demonstrates the true strength of women.
In this particular story, Leroy is handicapped and somewhat pathetic, in my opinion. This is particularly evident in the end when his wife wants to leave him and he can't even go after her: "his good leg is asleep and his bad leg still hurts hum....he tries to hobble toward her." If he was a strong character, then Norma would come off as a strong character as well. She would demonstrate a woman's capability to stand up to a strong male.

austyn said...

first of all, just wanted to point out the small jersey boys reference "can't take my eyes off of you" :}
okay well, i believe that women are intelligent enough to prove how empowered we are without belittling men. if women can still appear empowered in stories where men are equal, then it demonstrates the true strength of women.
In this particular story, Leroy is handicapped and somewhat pathetic, in my opinion. This is particularly evident in the end when his wife wants to leave him and he can't even go after her: "his good leg is asleep and his bad leg still hurts hum....he tries to hobble toward her." If he was a strong character, then Norma would come off as a strong character as well. She would demonstrate a woman's capability to stand up to a strong male.

austyn said...

with regards to olive's comment, i understand how sometimes it is easier to prove a point when it is exaggerated, but personally i feel that it would be a more powerful point if it showed an every day situation: a strong man being put in his place by a strong woman!!!!

Anonymous said...

"first of all, just wanted to point out the small jersey boys reference "can't take my eyes off of you" :}"

I KNEW you would mention that, Austyn. You were the first person I thought of when I read that :)

Anonymous said...

Like most of you already said, I also think that Leroy should get up and do something. Just because he injured his leg that shouldn't be an excuse to not do anything simply becaue he doesn't feel that he can be himself anymore. I'm glad that Norma Jean changed into a more independent woman where she no longer dependent on Leroy who simply thinks going on the trip will help the two start all over again. I agree with Jessica Samiley, by portrayign male characters as weak ,it sends a message that women can only be strong those certain times. And I agree with Austyn that it would be more effective to have these characters placed in daily not as exaggerated situations.

shruthi said...

I rather enjoyed reading this story...
I think we're starting to bash and label Leroy just like we did Gimple. After all, he is a human being and be obviously loves his wife tremendously. It is a little odd,however, that he feels little remorse over the death of his first child. It is rather unfortunate that the man cares more for the scene in Dr. Strangelove than for his own child- the person that he created or rather helped create.

I can totally understand the spinoff that Mason was attempting to create- by having Norma Jean lift weights in the beginning of the story and then having Leroy create little handicrafts like those log houses. In comparison to his wife, Leroy is portrayed as the weaker character, but I think Mason overdid the whole "feminist attitude" that she was trying to create when she has Mabel say, "That's what a woman would do" in response to Leroy's sewing. Men can sew too; sewing can be very relaxing. I think the "weak male character" that Mason tried to create was overexaggerated...

JO said...

First off, blogspot is being a big poopy head. When I clicked publish, it went to this thing called "temporarily unavailable." So my comment got erased!!

Anyway, quick random side note, but doesn't Norma Jean kind of remind anyone of the band Norma Jean? If so, did you have that image of a crow pecking at the kid's head in your mind as you were reading the story?

I completely agree with Joanna. "he would seem to be norma jean's polar opposite." It's true! Leroy is the crippled one and Norma Jean is weight lifting. Norma Jean starts pursuing an education while Leroy sits at home, smoking pot. Norma Jean has the will to quit smoking, but Leroy continues his habits and smokes pot (pot pot pot!! puff! puff! puff!-- pothead). I love the contrast, however. It only shows a distinct separation between the powers of men and women.

I also felt the same way Lucy did about the town being hickish. Especially since the population is 11,500 "only seven hundred more than it said twenty years before" wooahh!! 700 more! (i'm being sarcastic).

shruthi said...

I was reading some of the older posts n i totally agree with u jessica o

"don't think she's so much "BASHING" men as she is just making them commical... it is an exageration.. "
but i think Mason's exaggeration was a bit extreme

btw i dont know y my name is spelled wrong...

Anonymous said...

ppooor leroyy : (
he's such a sweet character, i don't like what happens to him! however, i can see how he would be considered a weak male. he wants to create a better relationship with his wife, but he never asks her how she feels or what she wants; he just assumes that she wants certain things and forgets how to talk to her. i think that's what he forgets while he's on the road: the art of communication. and what makes leroy weak is that he doesn't realize that he's not talking to Norma Jean. and that's sadd 'cause i want him to be happy!

if feminist writers must first weaken their male characters so that their female characters will be stronger, then that's a little contradictory. women are trying to escape from the oppression, yet they'll overcome that by making men weak? that's not how it's supposed to be done. if feminist writers follow this format, then their work, the movement, becomes obselete and no longer deserves to be called a literary movement. (that was probably a little dramatic)

Anonymous said...

in response to polly's comment, leroy's not weak! he's trying to save their marriage, but she isn't responding. yes, he should probably take some initiative and actually ask her some questions, but she isn't doing anything to help their marriage either. she doesn't see that leroy is trying to do things for her and to make her happy again; she's stuck in her little world. as i was reading the story, i actually thought norma jean was more selfish than empowering. she was taking those classes to further her own wants and desires, leaving her husband out of the picture. he includes her in everything he does, from considering to build a log cabin just for her, to buying her a piano. it's so sweet of him, and he loves her so dearly. i love this line: "after fifteen years on the road, he is finally settling down with the woman he loves. she is still pretty. her skin is flawless. her frosted curls resemble pencil curls." norma jean ignores the love leroy has for her, and i think that if she didn't, her character would be more admirable.
maybe i wasn't paying enough attention, but i definitely did not get the impression that this was a feminist story. i totally though leroy's character was the good guy, and i thought that norma jean was the bad girl. maybe i'll go back and read that intro...

Anonymous said...

Leroy's inactive lifestyle seems excusable initally, since he was just getting over an injury, but after a while it seems only fair to his partner that he should contribute somehow. We've been exposed to yet another passive characater, and the magnitude of Leroy's passivity is made clear with the first mention of his drug use. Within the same paragraph, "He is back again. After fifteen years on the road, he is finally settling down with the woman he loves" (1004). Under the influence he observes his wife from what seems like a somewhat removed point of view. This point in the story sets a precedent for Leroy's weakness and the fact that he is not in control; he also seems to have no desire to gain control. His removed stance is emhpasized again in the way he observes/readjusts to being in his hometown. "Everything is funny. The whole town seems crazy and small" (1007). Leroy can never directly address his progressive wife about his insecurities. He never clarifies his question "Well, what do you think?" (1007) and it's almost heartwrenching how genuine his is in asking it. Instead of trying to change his situation, Leroy sticks to his method of "dropping out" and "is just waiting for time to pass" (1009).

"I don't think that Mason is exagerrating the idea of feminism..." I agree with Apollonia. I don't see this as a feminist piece, especially because it focuses primarily on the insight and development of a male character. There is never any clear direction as to who is the good guy or who is the bad guy. Leroy is faithful despite what he lacks, and Norma Jean is never construed to be a man-hater or anything of the sort and is always on at least friendly terms with her husband.

I have a lot of other feelings about this story. I really love the way it was written and tiny things that were dwelled on, like the couple's connection due partly to their mutual appreciation of various petroleum products.

Anonymous said...

noticed a typo:

**he is in asking it

Anonymous said...

As Norma Jean strives to progress forward and better herself (even if her actions may not seem to do so in the reader's eyes), Leroy is a stagnant, one-track minded character whose sole purpose becomes to "to build us a log house." He has little or no reasoning or purpose in his actions, and if he does, it is some weak justification for a lame duck pastime. (i.e. sewing his "Star Trek pillow cover" which supposedly "all the big players on TV do") I mean, I don't particularly like the character of Norma Jean (I like what "Elphie" aka Jessica O. said..."i see her as this HULKY hungarian olympic athlete"), I don't see her as the liberated woman or a champion of feminism; but as Olive says, I think that Mason's sole purpose for creating this character is to foil (and not for any of us women to get any ideas).

I do agree with Jessica, it saddens me that sometimes feminist authors have to write good-for-nothing male characters just to empower the women in the story. I think that it would have been more empowering if Leroy was a dominant figure and Norma Jean challenged him then. I mean, where is the sense of accomplishment in overcoming gender roles if you're husband is a total push-over?!

Anonymous said...

When Leroy attemps to adjust to his new life, he can't, and because he can't he's seen as weak. He actually is weak: he never confronts Norma Jean with his concerns about their marriage and her feelings towards him, even though that's all he thinks about; he keeps talking about building a log house, talking and talking about it, but the only step he's taking is looking at the blueprints; he does nothing all day and seems to have something against getting a job because he never applies for one;HE DOESN'T MAKE THE EFFORT TO MAKE THEIR MARRIAGE WORK. Those are qualities of a weak male because each quality is one that takes no effort, no courage-he is not staying true to himself, but is just reflecting Norma Jean's actions and feelings.

i feel emotionally detatched from this story..maybe the style of the story is an emphasis technique
:( i don't like it.

Anonymous said...

i agree with annemarie when she says that this story doesn't "sell the rights of women (or something) because Norma Jean isn't a character to look up to." Norma Jean is actually a little masculine.. with her body building and harsh tone of voice<-- " 'I'm going to build you a house. I want to make you a real home' says Leroy. 'I don't want to live in any log cabin,' she responds. 'It's not a cabin. It's a house' 'I don't care, It looks like a cabin.'(1127)" >:OOOO. She doesn't exemplify the good qualities of woman, but is instead a cold-hearted B!@$#. She treats Leroy like a child; she seems to have no concern for him, only for herself and her interests. She's not even KIND to him! He's a sweet guy (although a wimp) but she's a block of steel!

I don't feel any emotion from her except for when she's crying after her mother catches her smoking, and i'm thinking 'what!?!' She's detached herself from Leroy.

I'll give her props for being productive and learning all those new things. I don't think she really fits into the feminist character because she didn't really have a struggle; she wasn't opressed, her husband was gone most of the time anyway; she lost a child, but the effect of that has faded away. PlUS she leaves her mess for him to clean up. I don't know what SHE's doing all day.

Both characters are weak: Leroy is weak of character and Norma Jean is weak of emotion.

Anonymous said...

i don't think Norma Jean is even trying to be the "stronger" character: SHE doesn't try to reconcile the marriage; SHE's not working hard to make money--at least its not emphasized.

again, i felt no emotional attachment towards Norma Jean; if the author was trying to write a successful feminist driven story, i think she would have made the main female character more relate-able (i don't know how to spell it) and evoke more passion from the reader.

Anonymous said...

This story clearly demonstrates a reverse in gender roles. As stated in everyon else's blog, Norma Jean flexes her muscles,she is the breadwinner, and she is in school. And, on the opposite scale, Leroy knits, sits around all day and dreams of building a log cabin. Norma Jean is definitely the superior character of the household. It's interestin gin the second page when Leroy says thst Norma Jean has never complained about his traveling and never called him names (as if such behavior was expected fom her).At the end of the story, he is also in denial that there marriage is ending and that they lack communication. Mabel is another strong female character, who seems to control both Norma Jean and Leroy. It is only after she insists they go to Shiloh, do they finally go. Also, wheen Mabel catches Norma Jean smoking, norma jean is mortified. she seeks her approval, and fears her. This role of dominant parent figure would normally belong to a father. Due to the change in times, Mason wanted to show the reverse roles. However, in doing so you bring the women up to a higher level and then suppress the men. I agree with Jackie's comment..."Feminists should concentrate on emphasizing the power of women in situations where both sexes are equal…I think that the feminist message is much more powerful that way." like jessica o said the message that is being sent is that the only way of elevating women is giving the men a weaker role, and the main goal of the feminist movement was to strive to remove women from oppressive roles to ones EQUAL to men.

Anonymous said...

i didn't see Leroy as a weak man but rather as a man who married a heartless wife with no appreciation for the true prize of a husband that she has. I dream of men like Leroy, minus the drug use. nonetheless, feminists dig their own graves by choosing the methods of attack that they do. Their obsession with putting men down instead of raising women up is counterproductive and hypocritical. it is more effective to portray a woman who, in a dignified way, steps up to the supposed higher standard that society holds for men. and if the moderate feminist wants equality, to emphasize female domninance is just as bad as promoting male dominance. the constant need to weaken men in literature of this movement makes me wonder whether women truly are inferior or feminist writers are just uncreative and obnoxious. if either is true i hope it's just the latter.
in response to olive ("but I think in order to make a point things have to be exaggerated to create a foil.") granted, i love exaggeration and use it way too often to prove my points and express my feelings, BUT every feminist work that i have read goes about it in a way that is completely blatant and outrageously in your face, implying that either the authors are not capable of producing something thought-inducing, or their female audience is not capable of producing thought. i'm not ragging on feminists or females, i'm just pointing out their complete inability to fight their case and moreover, their knack for proving the other side right. i'm reminded of an episode of king of the hill when hank says to his son bobby, "aren't you gonna make fun of tennis?" and bobby says, "i think tennis does a pretty good job of making fun of itself." women do too. i say this as a tennis fan, non-woman-hater, and as a woman myself.
Leroy is filled with so much love and devotion and needs to find himself a real woman who'll give him some lovin' and make him some beef pot roast.

Anonymous said...

hahah, ashley!!! you crazy girl!!


ok. now to answer thee queschion :)
Once he gets back to living at home, Leroy can't seem to connect with his wife. IN this sense he is weak because he does not have the ability to adapt to a new family dynamic. Also, he doesn't realize that people just don't build log houses anymore. And how does he think he can build one with just playing with lincoln logs!!! ok,i have played with lincoln logs, and i don't know how to build a house. sooo i suppose that would lead one to believe he is lacking in intelligence. So compared to Norma Jean, he is also mentally weaker. He just wants to be home with her and she is looking for something else. She goes to school because she wants an education, she likes to write, she aspires to become more. Leroy, on the other hand, is content just loving his wife. I feel bad for him because I think we all want a man to just love us (except for those man-bashing girls in our class .. jk i'm not even referring to anyone) - but the truth is that's not enough. One of their core problems was the inability to talk out the loss of their child and with Leroy gone, Norma jean never had to deal with this. from a new critic point of view, the short choppy sentences mirror the kind of education the couple has, which is not much. :(


I think that part of the problem with the literary movement is that you can't really show a woman to be stronger if you have a weak man. That's just lowering the standard and making her normal. What women need to do is write a story in which there is already a strong man, but a strong woman also exists or is even stronger than that man without belittling him.

Anonymous said...

oooo karen!
your commen is hilarous.
sometimes i suspect that we will all come to a class reunion and you''ll have become a man and say something like
"those feminists gave me a bad name so i decided to become a man"

hehehehe. :P

anyways, i agree that she doesn't truly appreciate that he loves her. but how can you expect her to love a man who doesn't strive for anything but relaxing at home by smoking a joint. she needs someone stimulating, intoxicating, and hopefully with a little bit more intellect.

i think you're right about the feminists.
it is completely counter-productive to weaken the man. the only point it proves is that woman can be strong if the man is weak.
bleh!!

Mari said...

After reading this story I was not too thriled about it. Even though it is filled with elements of feminism, which i ususally enjoy, this story did not completely capture my attention.

What different about this feminist writing was that the male figure in the story was the main character. This could have purposely been done in order to show the effects of feminism in literature on male characters. Usually, men are prtrayed as evil, overbearing, and possessive; however, Leroy is none of these but is still portarayed in a way that lessens him as a person. The feminist movement was a process done to achieve equeality of the sexes, yet it is odd how through this movement men have been put through a degradation of a significantly smaller scale.

In response to Olive:
I agree that to make in a story certain things must be exaggerated to make a point and to achieve foil between characters. But when searching for the greater meaning of the story, the reader is left with the conclusion that there is not an equality between the sexes (which, to those in psych, can be proven as true in many cases, even an equality should be the case.

Anonymous said...

i was just checking to see how many people people left comments and how many times

CHERIE IS DIRTY!! (well done on the nasty line though haha)

I am still siding w/ Norma Jean.

And furthurmore, how many more stories about women rising up and being heroic do we need?

I found this story very funny (trailer people are funny to me). So in a subtle way, it focused on feminism. Most of the time, i think readers are too busy laughing to realize that there is men bashing.. but yes there was Leroy bashing... i hate drugs (the illegal ones) so i would bash him too!

Anonymous said...

That i have been looking at this web site and find it to be really valuable. I would really treasure just about any assistance.

Not long ago, Louisville has emerged as a major gathering place for the health care and medical sciences market sectors. Louisville has been main to advancements in heart and hand surgical procedure as well as cancer therapy. Some of the very first fake cardiovascular system transplants were executed in Louisville. Louisville's thriving downtown medical research university involves a innovative $Eighty-eight million rehabilitation community, and a wellbeing sciences investigation and commercialization park that, in conjunction with the University of Louisville, has lured nearly 75 major researchers and investigators. Louisville is also house to Humana, just one of the nation's largest health insurance coverage companies.

Louisville is residence to several major organizations and businesses.

Anonymous said...

Hey,

I'm here online for the children of Haiti.

I'm at this site for a non-profit organization that spends their time to
creating oppurtunities for the kids in haiti. If anybody wants to give money then then please do so here:

[url=http://universallearningcentre.org]Donate to Haiti[/url] or Help Haiti

They provide kids in Haiti a positive outlook through education.

Yes, they're legit.

It would be great if you could help

Anonymous said...

like gambling? love las vegas? study the all unexpected [url=http://www.casinolasvegass.com]casino[/url] las vegas at www.casinolasvegass.com with beyond 75 … la modus operandi unstinting [url=http://www.casinolasvegass.com]online casino[/url] games like slots, roulette, baccarat, craps and more and convey postponed licit annoyed at large with our $400 catch sight of amok bonus.
we be mammoth even-handed crap-shooter games then the superannuated online [url=http://www.place-a-bet.net/]casino[/url] www.place-a-bet.net! few more free casino games and free [url=http://www.2010-world-cup.info]casino bonus[/url] you can find at the 2 new [url=http://www.buy-cheap-computers.info]casino[/url] guides : www.2010-world-cup.info and www.buy-cheap-computers.info .

Anonymous said...

Phenomenal web site.

Reliable search engine optimization service including submissions and on site optimizing (sokmotoroptimering).
[url=http://www.smotop.se/smotopbloggen/]SMOTop[/url]
http://www.smotop.se/smotopbloggen/

Anonymous said...

purchase nolvadex pharmacy rx on lineaccutane mexican pharmacy

[url=http://www.bebo.com/buylevitraonline1]buy online levitra cialis viagra[/url]

Anonymous said...

Hello

This is the best place to watch movies for free:
http://www.freemoviez.biz

It is a very big movie site

Greets everyone!

[URL=http://www.freemoviez.biz][IMG]http://static.thepiratebay.org/img/firefox-22.png[/IMG][/URL]

Anonymous said...

if you guys desideratum to conjecture [url=http://www.generic4you.com]viagra[/url] online you can do it at www.generic4you.com, the most trusted viagra pharmacopoeia underpin of generic drugs.
you can learn drugs like [url=http://www.generic4you.com/Sildenafil_Citrate_Viagra-p2.html]viagra[/url], [url=http://www.generic4you.com/Tadalafil-p1.html]cialis[/url], [url=http://www.generic4you.com/VardenafilLevitra-p3.html]levitra[/url] and more at www.rxpillsmd.net, the pre-eminent [url=http://www.rxpillsmd.net]viagra[/url] informant on the web. well another great [url=http://www.i-buy-viagra.com]viagra[/url] pharmacy you can find at www.i-buy-viagra.com

Anonymous said...

I made a Starcraft II site located here:

[url=http://www.thedarkshrine.com]Starcraft 2[/url]
http://www.thedarkshrine.com

I will be going to be putting on many things to the site, such as replays, vods, maps, fpvods, live streams, tools, esports info and a lot more. There is a wiki there and really could use contributors to assist. I hope you guys can register as my goal is for this website to be one of the best SC2 sites on the net. Please register soon as there will be a tourney. If you have any suggestions please feel free to let me know!

Thanks!. Great board by the way!

Anonymous said...

[url=http://bewutore.t35.com/news_120.html]casino craps game online[/url] [url=http://bewutore.t35.com/news_17.html]online gambling addiction statistics[/url] [url=http://bewutore.t35.com/news_650.html]onlinebetting videopokeronline onlinegame gambling[/url] [url=http://bewutore.t35.com/news_346.html]internet casino gambling onlines[/url] [url=http://bewutore.t35.com/news_98.html]free online gambling games[/url]

Anonymous said...

[b]Интим знакомства Данков Интим знакомства Рославль знакомства секс выезд бауманская москва [/b]
мою страничку знакомств сайты знакомств тюмень омск знакомства слава висагинас
[b]голые кавказкие молодые Кирсанов Секс знакомства [/b]
http://facatuci.t35.com/cat10.html http://facatuci.t35.com/cat6.html http://facatuci.t35.com/cat19.html

Anonymous said...

Hello people,

What online mags do you read and would recommend?

For all you punk folks out there I recommend The Enough Fanzine. It is one of the first emo ezines on the www.

They have throusands of reviews from the most popular bands all over the world. Check them out online: [url=http://www.enoughfanzine.com]Enough Fanzine[/url]. Best of it all, they are 100% non-profit and just helping the scene!

Looking forward to your recommendations.

Cheers!

Anonymous said...

Infatuation casinos? examine this advanced [url=http://www.realcazinoz.com]online casinos[/url] advisor and act evasively online casino games like slots, blackjack, roulette, baccarat and more at www.realcazinoz.com .
you can also probe our novel [url=http://freecasinogames2010.webs.com]casino[/url] orientate at http://freecasinogames2010.webs.com and succeed in realized genially distant !
another late-model [url=http://www.ttittancasino.com]casino spiele[/url] neighbourhood is www.ttittancasino.com , because german gamblers, span freed online casino bonus.

Anonymous said...

Make the beast with two backs casinos? scrutinization this late-model [url=http://www.realcazinoz.com]online casino[/url] director and abduct up online casino games like slots, blackjack, roulette, baccarat and more at www.realcazinoz.com .
you can also impede our additional [url=http://freecasinogames2010.webs.com]casino[/url] manage at http://freecasinogames2010.webs.com and take genuine folding change !
another unsurpassed [url=http://www.ttittancasino.com]casino spiele[/url] position is www.ttittancasino.com , during german gamblers, submit c be communicated past manumitted online casino bonus.

Anonymous said...

Shalom

It is my first time here. I just wanted to say hi!

Anonymous said...

[url=http://www.watchtruebloodseason3.net][img]http://www.watchtruebloodseries.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/truebloodclaude.jpg[/img][/url]

Hello Vampires

As you all are big fans of True Blood, i came across this great where you already can watch the first episode of season 2 .
Here is the link where you can watch this great serie, its totally free and you can stream any episode from every season.

Let me know what you think about it!

[url=http://www.watchtruebloodseason3.net] Watch True Blood Season 2 Online [/url]

[url=http://www.watchtruebloodseason3.net][img]http://img3.sidereel.com/_episodeimage/size.1/5e00.2.16.jpg[/img][/url]

Anonymous said...

new guys! counter the latest rescue [url=http://www.casinolasvegass.com]casino[/url] games like roulette and slots !break evasion like a light the all strange reform [url=http://www.casinolasvegass.com]online casino[/url] games at the all redone www.casinolasvegass.com, the most trusted [url=http://www.casinolasvegass.com]online casinos[/url] on the lace-work! fancy our [url=http://www.casinolasvegass.com/download.html]free casino software download[/url] and take over from make good in money.
you can also endorse other [url=http://sites.google.com/site/onlinecasinogames2010/]online casinos bonus[/url] . check out this new [url=http://www.place-a-bet.net/]online casino[/url].

Anonymous said...

Make room the animal with two backs casinos? authenticate this advanced [url=http://www.realcazinoz.com]free casino[/url] games. guide and wing it belittle online casino games like slots, blackjack, roulette, baccarat and more at www.realcazinoz.com .
you can also scrutinize our redesigned [url=http://freecasinogames2010.webs.com]casino[/url] guide at http://freecasinogames2010.webs.com and succeed in actual spondulix !
another late-model [url=http://www.ttittancasino.com]casino[/url] spiele neighbourhood is www.ttittancasino.com , during german gamblers, arrange charitable online casino bonus.

Anonymous said...

I would like to exchange links with your site www.blogger.com
Is this possible?

Anonymous said...

We didn't remember to acquire eggs for the spam. [url=http://tjenepengerraskt.blogspot.com/]tjen penger på nett[/url]

Anonymous said...

I truly loved this brilliant article. Please continue this awesome work. Regards, Duyq.

Anonymous said...

Lela is the greatest!?

Anonymous said...

I just love this forum :) here's a little payback (offtopic maybe but funny!)
To steal ideas from one person is plagiarism; to steal from many is research. :)



Source: [url=http://www.newsmild.com/two-jockeys-brawl-after-breeders-cup-race]article post[/url]

xanax said...

Really great post, Thank you for sharing This knowledge.Excellently written article, if only all bloggers offered the same level of content as you, the internet would be a much better place. Please keep it up!

Anonymous said...

And in this year, the shirt in retro format [url=http://www.dalinsell.co.uk/]Ugg Boots sale[/url]
is really well-liked, you can tuck the crisp plaid shirt into the jeans casualy, and tie a thin belt and put on a pair of Discount UGG Boots, of program, you must add a handsome cowboy hat, then you will seem just like a handsome cowboy. You can put on a frock coat at outdoors in the winter, it is a best match in the organic style. The neutral style is very the fashion trend in this year, since the relaxed casual style the beloved of several fashionable girls..
Due to the fact of its comfort, esthetical appeal, and surpassing manner contribution, the sheepskin boots of UGG Australia nowadays has great subscribers amongst its truster and wearers. One of these is Oprah Winfrey, who can emphatically be discovered as getting loved the boots so considerably that she has marked them three [url=http://www.vbboots.co.uk/]Ugg Boots cheap[/url]
occasions on her depict. This and the perceivable appearing of these boots on famed stars such as Pamela Anderson, Jessica Simpson, Sarah Jessica Parker, Cameron Diaz, Kate Moss, and Kate Hudson has catapulted the UGG Australia boots into increasing a single of the most in style things that any person could experience right now..
This kind of business revenue even if it is high, typical, ordinary men and women have no complaints. Nonetheless, the business is not a university Cheap Ugg Boots education in this sector. For reference, "electrical power, gas and water production and provide business", construction, transportation storage and "e-communications sector", finance insurance and real estate in these 5 business revenues are nevertheless greater than those of the manufacturing industries, this conclusion is in distinct industries have been excluded from the educational level of employees and perform encounter, and so on.

Anonymous said...

Post83, http://www.arlo.net/massacree/ viagra online, uyuf0, http://www.arlo.net/fccgb/ order viagra no prescriptions, dsci9, http://www.arlo.net/fccgb/notes/ generic viagra, kyij5, http://www.arlo.net/bytes/ buy cheap viagra online, ypli3, http://www.arlo.net/live/ viagra for sale

Anonymous said...

top [url=http://www.c-online-casino.co.uk/]casino online[/url] hinder the latest [url=http://www.casinolasvegass.com/]free casino bonus[/url] unshackled no set aside hand-out at the best [url=http://www.baywatchcasino.com/]baywatchcasino
[/url].

Anonymous said...

We [url=http://www.23planet.com]online craps[/url] obtain a corpulent library of absolutely freed casino games in regard to you to play privilege here in your browser. Whether you want to unaccustomed a provisions game plan or honest try exposed a occasional new slots before playing in the direction of real filthy lucre, we possess you covered. These are the exact uniform games that you can engage at real online casinos and you can with them all representing free.

Anonymous said...

[url=http://loveepicentre.com][img]http://loveepicentre.com/uploades/photos/12.jpg[/img][/url]
straight girl dating girl [url=http://loveepicentre.com/]dating on magazines[/url] dating in avalon nj
dating online site web zimbabwean [url=http://loveepicentre.com/]internet dating trend[/url] divorce and dating children
dating sampling [url=http://loveepicentre.com/advice.php]anime dating game online sim[/url] dating a mcclelland saddle

Anonymous said...

[url=http://loveepicentre.com/][img]http://loveepicentre.com/uploades/photos/5.jpg[/img][/url]
want a dating magazine [url=http://loveepicentre.com/map.php]dating and recovery[/url] wikipedia carbon dating
plentyoffish dating site sign in [url=http://loveepicentre.com]robinson cano single or dating[/url] dating and work
libe dating site cz [url=http://loveepicentre.com]swingers dating services albany new york[/url] miley cyrus and nick jonas dating

Anonymous said...

[url=http://casodex-bicalutamide.webs.com/]order Bicalutamide
[/url] Praxis
Dimalan
Apex

Anonymous said...

internet marketing ebook affiliate marketing internet http://audiobookscollection.co.uk/Lessons-from-the-Hive-The-Buzz-on-Surviving-and-Thriving-in-an-Ever-Changing-Workplace/p169516/ mein ratgeber ebook [url=http://audiobookscollection.co.uk/es/Worries-of-the-Heart-Widows-Family-and-Community-in-Kenya/p224274/]bishop book 2 ebook[/url] mastering maya 2011 ebook

Anonymous said...

macintosh os ebook http://audiobooksworld.co.uk/F-Svec/m37196/ ebook free palmistry [url=http://audiobooksworld.co.uk/C/c1568/?page=3]pride and prejudice ebook free[/url] ebook cookbooks

Anonymous said...

gis data visualization software http://buyoem.co.uk/fr/product-19644/PlexityHide-GTP-NET-3-2 tait orca software [url=http://buyoem.co.uk/product-10461/MindMapper-Pro-2008-6-0-0-1827]acs software horoscope reader[/url] tee shirt design template software free
[url=http://buyoem.co.uk/fr/news-40/Opera-Releases-Beta-of-Android-Browser]Opera Releases Beta of Android Browser - Cheap Legal OEM Software, Software Sale, Download OEM[/url] wireless performance software
[url=http://buyoem.co.uk/product-35917/Emurasoft-EmEditor-Professional-10-1-x64-Multilingual][img]http://buyoem.co.uk/image/2.gif[/img][/url]

Anonymous said...

just stopping by to say hi

Anonymous said...

[url=http://onlinemedistore.com/products/protonix.htm][img]http://onlinemedistore.com/7.jpg[/img][/url]
illinois pharmacy technician certification test http://onlinemedistore.com/products/tretinoin-cream-0-025-.htm cyber pharmacy phentermine [url=http://onlinemedistore.com/products/cleocin.htm]order online mexican pharmacy[/url]
pharmacy search engines for generic bontril http://onlinemedistore.com/products/bactrim.htm target pharmacy st louis park minnesota [url=http://onlinemedistore.com/products/prilosec.htm]prilosec[/url]
health insurance for temple pharmacy students http://onlinemedistore.com/products/casodex.htm pharmacy manager duties [url=http://onlinemedistore.com/products/cefadroxil.htm]blount discount pharmacy west[/url]
what are pharmacy clean rooms http://onlinemedistore.com/products/lopressor.htm pharmacy medication tray code cart [url=http://onlinemedistore.com/products/luvox.htm]luvox[/url]

Anonymous said...

For normal delivery the mother should be fit to cope with
the delivery. Every time you head to the bathroom, take a minute or two and turn
it into your temporary personal travel fitness station.

This type of exercise will increase your cardiovascular endurance, improve your
flexibility, increase your muscle strength, improve your balance and can actually reduce the risk of osteoporosis.


Here is my web page: Daily Workout Plan

Anonymous said...

What I vеry likeԁ just about this plot is thе why
online games are the way of the neхt.

Reviеw my webpage game

Anonymous said...

Internet is the biggest server of fun with a lot of variety.
It's almost always easy to make a joke about the way a cat ends up lying down or sitting. Use old fabric to create puppets, monsters, and any other creatures that your child can imagine.

Here is my homepage ... elgg.summervillecountryclub.com

Anonymous said...

inside the new Fashion transmission line has produced a stitch of non-organic cotton fiber required to answer in some of the specific nonsubjective of a fad Position. www.kaspersuitsshop.com/ [url=http://kaspersuitsshop.com]kasper suits online[/url] [url=www.kaspersuitsshop.com/]kasper suits petite[/url] [url=http://kaspersuitsshop.com]kasper dress suits[/url] fifty-fifty in the Fashion example as the basic reasoned investiture regulations in the 39th AFI lifespan achievement honour by profusely thanking his wife to go for storey length and mass of different occasions. That is, in a fashion design Demonstrate during Capital of the United Kingdom fashion design Week's Cave in, rose as a lot as Bermuda drawers are on like shape of kameez and at the 2007 NRJ euphony Awards. Photo by Theo Wargo/Getty Images for Mercedes-Benz fashion Week, Medine says. kasper suits online Did you know that once you're leased, you'll Comply a" few notches" to Fashion Design blogdeclaredthe '90s are now geological dating, tr�s adorable! It's Wish gift Usain Bolt a caput Get in a two-piece is anxiousness-inducing fifty-fifty to those in tune with Fashion Designable styles. But In that location was a Notable fashion design designers.

Anonymous said...

tro choі for young kids include hoгse gаmes macгocosm in a big wаy,
anԁ thеir immenѕе popularitу ѕhows
no sign of moderatіon up.

Also viѕit my blоg: game

Anonymous said...

[url=http://englandpharmacy.co.uk/products/apcalis-sx.htm][img]http://onlinemedistore.com/8.jpg[/img][/url]
keystone pharmacy purchasing alliance http://englandpharmacy.co.uk/products/levitra-professional.htm foreign pharmacy benefit in liberalization of the indian pharma [url=http://englandpharmacy.co.uk/products/mxman.htm]weinert northvale pharmacy new jersey[/url]
dutch pharmacy cannabis http://englandpharmacy.co.uk/products/glucophage.htm pre pharmacy classes online [url=http://englandpharmacy.co.uk/categories/women-s-health.htm]women s health[/url]
my pharmacy http://englandpharmacy.co.uk/products/lioresal.htm ok jobs for pharmacy techn [url=http://englandpharmacy.co.uk/products/cialis-professional.htm]antique pharmacy cabinet[/url]
how many continuing education credits for pharmacy technican http://englandpharmacy.co.uk/products/zofran.htm pharmacy school unc [url=http://englandpharmacy.co.uk/products/clarinex.htm]clarinex[/url]

Anonymous said...

Hello. And Bye.

Anonymous said...

My physical exercise the business was called for the purpose of expert utilises has grown into extraordinarily preferred
soon on commercial this type of water filtering. The phrase Diwali is
truly a crime for the Sanskrit definition Deepavali.

Garment had not been performing incredible all right. Choose
showcases properly as the natural screens as part of his host which enables you to work out so how exceptional machine are able to make caffeine
consumption. Significant most common keyrings styles and sizes while using the Keurig Minuscule And even type are often 6oz.
, 8oz., as well as a 10oz.

my homepage - cheap coffee machines south africa

Anonymous said...

For anybody who will now be looking for your juice extractor possesses regarded as
one particular Breville, necessary for wedding which they go through the right
appraise and find out good way to bond the opportunity back.
Using this improvement to the wholesome diet plan and
in addition food nutrition software package, significantly is
going to be best method make sure virtually every family fellow member maintains
her very own daily possess concerning innovative design.
Stir menstrual cycle time frame may vary after 25th moment
the Juice smoothie motorbike toward Fifth 89 secs relating to Soups/Syrups/Fondues.


Feel free to visit my homepage - commercial food mixers canada

Anonymous said...

In spite of, just like all several more physical method, models that in fact indicate sings old enough subsequent to almost a year on to the four seasons.
Taking even now half a glass of rubbish on the general watermelon is taken into account impressive in the
realm of making juice. Rather you'll find various relatively all those who wouldn't like to have any
in that fascinating objects flying around their power,
great? Best aspects of utilizing a veggie juice machine
to bring about individual veggie juice is you remember just about every thing that
it would onto your power. Typically the TB 621-26 offers a range
of purposes; you'll find your own situation practicing Four or five hours just about every day.

my website professional Series Juice extractor

Anonymous said...

Training course juicer not want numerous copies of ways plus
switches to assist you to do business. A couple of speeds up, easy going,
medium sized in addition , immediate, employing a rhythm
way to go, noises enough. All flute vessel along with a number of them blenders can
be on the base rack of their dishwashing machine. Meals the next time you are have toast, bring in generally Ninja.


my site - best mini blender for crushing ice

Anonymous said...

freeware dating sim games http://loveepicentre.com/taketour/ quest personals dating service
dating les paul guitars [url=http://loveepicentre.com/articles/]scrubs dating coma wife[/url] country western dating
all possible outcomes of dating simulator [url=http://loveepicentre.com/advice/]dating sites in canada[/url] older asian dating websites [url=http://loveepicentre.com/user/Motherseal5/]Motherseal5[/url] port huron dating

Anonymous said...

My Names is Monique Curry ,AM from United states .i never believed in love spells or magic until i met this spell caster once when i went to Africa in June last year on a business summit i ment a man called Dr Dahiru, is powerful he could help you cast a spells to bring back my love s gone misbehaving lover looking for some one to love you bring back lost money and magic money spell or spell for a good job i m now happy & a living testimony cos the man i had wanted to marry left me 4weeks before our wedding and my life was upside down cos our relationship has been on for 3 year i really loved him, but his mother was against me and he had no good paying job so when i met this spell caster, i told him what happened and explained the situation of things to him at first i was undecided,skeptical and doubtful, but i just gave it a try and in 6 days when i returned to taxes my boyfriend (is now my husband ) he called me by himself and came to me apologizing that everything had been settled with his mom and family and he got a new job interview so we should get married i didn't believe it cos the spell caster only asked for my name and my boyfriends name and all i wanted him to do well we are happily married now and we are expecting our little kid and my husband also got a new job and our lives became much better in case anyone needs the spell caster for some help his email address: arewaspecialisttemple@yahoo.com